How to Redefine Success Without Losing Yourself with Jenn Bieri

Welcome to episode 286 of the Business Development Podcast.

And today I'm joined by the incredible Jen Beary, a transformational coach, finance expert and wellness advocate who helps leaders align authenticity with authority.

From scaling a global tech startup from 40 to 400 employees and raising 20 million in capital, to guiding executives through burnout and back to balance Gen Story is about courage, clarity and redefining what real success looks like.

Stick with us.

You won't want to miss this episode.

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Welcome to the Business Development Podcast.

And now your expert host, Kelly Kennedy.

Hello.

Welcome to episode 286 of the Business Development Podcast.

And today it is my absolute pleasure to bring you Jenn Beary.

Jen is a transformational coach, finance expert and wellness advocate who empowers leaders to align authenticity with authority.

With over a decade of corporate experience as a CPA and operations leader, Jen's career is marked by scaling a global tech startup from 40 to 400 employees, driving 20 million in capital raises and leading high impact initiatives that revolutionized business operations.

Combining her business acumen with certifications in coactive coaching, human design and Reiki, Jen guides her clients towards meaningful, sustainable growth in both their professional and personal lives.

She is deeply committed to helping leaders explore paths that align with their values, purpose and ambition.

Driven by a mission to redefine leadership, Jen takes a holistic approach that blends strategy, mindfulness and energy alignment.

Whether facilitating career breakthroughs, building leadership confidence, or helping clients overcome limiting beliefs, she creates lasting impact with every interaction.

Jen doesn't just help her clients rise, she equips them to thrive.

Her work isn't just about success.

It's about transformation, purpose, and living a life of bold impact and authenticity.

Jen, it is a honor to have you on the show today.

Oh my gosh, that was so good.

I'm like sitting there like, wow, that was.

That was really good.

Honestly, it's such an honor to be here, Kelly.

I'm so happy we're finally doing this and thanks for having me on the show.

It's super cool.

We initially connected.

You reached out to me when we both won a peaks emerging leader award in 2024.

Yeah, we did.

Congrats to us.

That was pretty cool.

That was definitely one of the highlights of 2024 for me.

Oh, man, me too.

Also, because, like, I love the peak.

It's something that I've been getting into probably over the last year or two, and I just love what they're doing.

So.

Yeah, that was such a big honor for me too.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

And then, you know, when we initially made contact and had that conversation.

I am such an advocate for wellness.

I know as, like, as a leader myself, and I work with so many leaders.

All of us are struggling.

And it's so funny.

We talked about this really briefly before the show today, but I think most of the time it's the leadership who needs, like, emotional support.

Not typically the people under them.

Like obviously everybody does on a certain level, But I think people just assume that the leadership has it all figured out, that they're all good.

And I think we just forget we're all people.

Oh, my God.

A hundred percent.

Like, I laugh because honestly, like, one of the things that I coach probably the most on is like, my clients come to me and they're like, so I don't eat lunch.

I'm starving through the day because I'm going back to.

Back from meeting to meeting.

Or it's like, I don't work out.

I really am not taking care of myself, you know, And I laugh because it's like, not cause it's funny, but because it's such a universal problem that it's.

It feels like, you know, the smarter we are and the.

The more we're developing ourselves, the more we're also forgetting to take care of ourselves.

Oh, my goodness.

Like, both those things.

Check, check.

My gosh.

I've struggled with them both.

I don't know, though.

Yeah, it's a tough one.

I just.

I think.

I don't know what it is.

I don't know why it is that I don't always make the time for those things.

I think in my mind, like, I'm just prioritizing the work, I'm prioritizing the show, I'm prioritizing the growth.

And obviously it's funny because you would think that we would always put our own health and our own.

Our own needs ahead of that.

But I think as leaders, we're so dedicated to the task or the mission that we're on that it it tends to come first.

Totally.

It does.

And I think it, it is a paradox, right?

Because it's like, you know, what I know is we're all aware that if we don't take care of ourselves that like, it's not like our success will not be sustainable because we're going to reach burnout or some kind of illness or get sick, sick or whatever.

But at the same time I think it's just like, I don't know if it's like the deep rooted conditioning as we were like raised and in society or like whatever it is, but it's just like, I think we all fundamentally have like the same limiting beliefs of like, we tie our value to how much we're producing.

Right.

Like I'm totally a checkbox ticker.

If you give me a list of things to do, I'm like, oh yeah, let me keep checking these off, you know, And I get a lot of pride from doing it.

Yeah.

And I think because of that it's like, you know, meditating.

It's like, well, I have to be quiet for 10 minutes.

Like that feels like a waste of time.

You know how much I could do in 10 minutes?

Oh my goodness, no.

And you know, I'm horrible for that too.

I did, I did try the meditating thing.

It does work.

I just like, I struggled to keep with it.

I think was kind of my, my struggle.

I think my problem is, is that when I get up in the morning and if I have an extra hour that I can do something, it's like, okay, hold on, I got this hour.

I'm going to be more productive.

Like it never comes back to be, oh, I'm going to go in the hot tub or I'm going to go look after myself for, you know, this hour.

Like that never ever, ever is the thing, Jen.

And I don't know why, I don't know whether that's like my own programming.

Like you said, my, like my need to succeed.

Right.

Like, I've just, I've always like had this like hard work ethic.

And I don't think there's anything wrong with hard work.

I don't think that, I don't think that anything big happens without a conceded effort, without somebody putting in some.

But you still have to make the time for yourself.

And I think as leaders, and I'm excited to talk with you about this today, as leaders, we need tips on how we can do that better.

But before we do, how the heck did you end up on this path?

Who is Jen B.

This is Always like the.

I don't know, maybe like the awkward and also like the.

It's such a winded path that it's like kind of hard to describe sometimes because, you know, I started my career in finance and accounting.

You know, like my first job out of school was at Grant Thornton as an auditor.

And.

And so, yeah, so I, you know, I built up a amaz career in finance.

I ended up in accounting and I ended up in tech.

And I just love tech because I just find it like such an interesting field and I love that it's so future focused.

Yeah.

And so I ended up with an opportunity to work at a startup in Toronto.

And it was like being on a rocket ship.

Like, it was moving fast.

Like in five years.

It was like the amount of growth we had.

Like, it was a global company and it was amazing.

I eventually moved from accounting and finance into business operations.

And my role was really about, like, how do we work better together?

So, like, as we're growing and scaling and we're like in Australia and Singapore and Canada and the U.S. and you know, lots of plans to keep expanding.

You know, how, like in time zones where there's literally no overlap in working, like in business hours, like, how do you function in like that.

And again, we weren't like 2000 people company.

Like, it was still small.

Like, I think when we, at 40 people, we were already like Australia and Canada.

So anyways, and that, that time zone alone is just crazy.

Yeah.

And so during then, the pandemic happened and like, you know, that kind of like shifted everything for, I think everyone.

And so I found myself spending a lot more time at home.

And my partner Dave was like, he'd always wanted to start a YouTube channel and so he'd been bugging me, like, hey, can we do a YouTube channel?

Like, maybe you could teach yoga.

Because he knew that, you know, the funny thing is, so September the 21th.

Sorry, September in 2011, I started my job at Grant Thornton as an auditor.

And I also went to my first yoga class.

Wow.

And so I always laugh because that kind of feels like this marker point where it was like I started becoming two different people.

Like, there was this like super ambitious corporate gen, as they call her, and just like grinding, like super strong work ethic, like, you know, wants to get up the corporate ladder, like, as fast as possible.

Like, there's this real clear ambition and then there's like yoga Jen, it's like wanting to quit her job, like, travel the world, like, teach yoga.

A little bit of a hippie, you Know, kind of into some of the Woo stuff.

And so Dave, my partner, we've been together a really long time, and so he's like, jen, you've been saying you've wanted to do this forever, so, like, let's start this YouTube channel.

And I'm like, are you kidding?

I'm like, I'm like a professional.

I can't go on YouTube and teach yoga and, like, bare naked, like, what?

Yeah.

And anyway, we had nothing better to do, so we started the YouTube channel.

And that was kind of where I started getting a lot more into the wellness side.

Yeah.

And then that tech company was sold, and I kind of just took that as my sign that, like, you know what?

I've always wanted to start my own business, and if I don't do it now, then when am I going to do it?

Like, how much longer am I going to wait?

And so I kind of worked it out, quit my big corporate job and started building a yoga business.

And it was amazing.

I took it off YouTube.

I started doing it online and started teaching, like, some wellness programs and doing that kind of thing.

And what I realized now is while I was going through that, I was completely burnt out.

Yeah.

I don't think I fully realized, like, how much the pandemic had impacted me.

And, like, also just working on that pace in tech for so long.

And so part of it was, like, a bit of recovery and trying to navigate that.

And then I think it was two years ago, I kind of hit a moment where I'm like, man, I really love the wellness side, but, like, I miss that pace.

I miss the pace of it solving complex problems, like working with people and developing them.

And, you know, just in that energy, in that.

And so I found coaching, and lucky for me, that kind of brought all the worlds together.

And so I've just been building it up since then.

That is absolutely incredible.

And I want to kind of chat about, obviously, that leap to your own entrepreneurship, because on the show, you know, we're always talking to young entrepreneurs.

We're always talking to people who maybe haven't even taken that leap yet.

It's on their mind, or they're kind of finding this show as, like, maybe a space to help them take that jump.

And I know for me, it was really scary.

And I think for a lot of people, they underestimate the fear that goes along with taking your own work into your hands.

Right.

Like, you know, there's something that feel safe about working for a company where it's just like, oh, yeah, like, I Can work for them.

But, you know, if I get let go, I can just go find another job.

I think there's, like, this, like, fear that, like, we can't do it ourselves.

And yet, you know, starting my own company was the most empowering thing.

None of this would have happened had I not made that, like, initial jump.

And I'm so thankful that I was brave enough to do that at the time.

But I also remember how scared I was, and I needed a kick in the butt.

So for me, what ended up happening was my boss pulled me into my office.

I'd worked at the company for 10 years, and he goes, kelly, like, pandemic.

We have no idea what this looks like.

We literally can't even meet with people.

At the time, we were doing very much, like, old school business development.

Dropping by companies, dropping by businesses, dropping brochures, whatever.

He's like, look like, I don't know what happens.

I want to make sure you're okay.

Maybe start making a plan for, like, what the next year might look like if you weren't here.

So at least I got that.

Oh, my God.

Thank God.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But at the time, I'd been mulling it, and that's the thing.

I thought about starting my own business development firm for a long time, but, you know, I mean, I never wanted to take that risk.

It was like.

It was like, well, I have this, like, steady paycheck.

I don't really got to worry.

It's great.

It's a great paycheck.

I don't really want to, like, rock that boat, but, you know, when I kind of got that kick in the butt, ended up getting the severance, I launched capital.

And then actually, what was really cool was that same employer hired me back, so gave me my boost.

So, like, honestly, it's angry inspection service.

I still to this day owe them, you know, oh, Salvador Nadar, the owner of that company, you know, a great.

Thank you.

He did me a great service.

And I don't think, like, I don't think companies realize sometimes how much service they can do to their employees by just being kind and doing something like that for them.

But 100.

I 100% agree.

But I. I needed that kick in the butt.

But I'll tell you what, when I did do that kick in the butt and I did, you know, take it under, I was surprised at, like, at how much I could step up to the plate, Honestly, I surprised myself with my own ability to be able to look after myself to start my own company and the empowerment that Comes with that is huge.

But yeah, you know, I always love to know.

Talk to me about that because for you, honestly, you were in a much better space than even I was at that time.

I can't imagine what it must have been like to quit an incredible corporate job to go out and take that risk.

Tell me about that.

It was.

I don't know if I'm allowed to swear on this show, but like, it was scary.

As you know.

That's probably the only way to describe it because, you know, I had been feeling it a long time.

It was like a thought in my mind.

But here's you, here's the thing is like my.

So like Dave and I at that point, let me think.

We've been together 11 years, so.

And I quit almost three years ago, so we've been together like nine.

Nine years.

No, I'm so bad at math, which is weird because I'm an accountant.

So.

Eight years.

Yeah.

And so we've been together eight years at the time, you know, and he'd been supporting my career because, like, you know, we.

The goal was I was going to be a C level executive.

Right.

So, like, I had that right from the get go.

And so, you know, he was, he, he had been supporting me through that.

Like, I was working all night sometimes, you know, I was traveling all over the world sometimes.

Like, it was really intense.

Yeah.

And so, you know, the big payoff was going to be for this extremely expansive C level role.

And I had grown so much.

And so that was sort of like the quote unquote plan that we were building.

Yeah.

And so my biggest fear was, how the heck am I going to tell Dave that I don't want to do this anymore?

Because, like, he didn't sign up for me not doing that, you know, so, like, what does that mean?

And so it started with just a conversation with him to say, hey, I think I want to quit.

And I think I need to figure, figure something out because I really want to start my own business.

And I mean, he was very shocked at first.

You know, the first was like, oh my gosh.

Because, you know, I was the breadwinner, I was the stability.

He works in construction.

So sometimes there's periods where, you know, he, he'll.

He'll be off for a few months.

And so I was that consistency.

And so it was like, okay, so like, okay, so how do we rethink this?

Like, what, what are we going to do then?

Because we have a mortgage.

We still have like all these things to do.

So, like, how do we navigate that?

Yeah.

And so it took a couple conversations for us to kind of like work out the details and figure out, like, what was really important for him as I was making that shift.

And basically we worked out a dollar amount.

He was like, look, he's like, you know what?

He's like, I think we can make it work, but, you know, you have to make sure you've got some kind of cash flow coming into the business or like into your life.

Y.

Because we can't.

Do you not.

Not having that.

Yeah.

And so I was like, okay, I hear you.

And so then I was like, okay, so now we've got a plan.

At least we're kind of like on the same page.

And now I just have to figure out like, is this a part time job?

Is this, like, what is this?

Do I get some contract work that I can lock in?

Do I maybe see if I can work part time at my existing company?

You know, how do I start figuring out what my options are going to be?

And so from there I just started talking about it.

And so I started, I told my parents about it, I told my.

The CEO of my company about it.

And so, like, it was a long winded plan.

Like, it was a few months before I actually put in my resignation because I wanted to make sure that we felt good about the plan.

And so what ended up happening is my dad's got a business and he was like, you know what, I'm in a pretty good position right now.

I think I can help you guys out and I kind of want you to work for me anyways.

So why don't, you know, why don't you just come work with me and that way you'll get ultimate flexibility over your time.

And I also had some other options, but honestly, that was probably the best one.

And so I just, I took a giant leap of faith and I just said, you know what?

Worst case, I can go back.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I love that.

Okay.

I always love to ask, so was your dad always an entrepreneur, like your whole life?

Yes.

Amazing.

Okay.

Okay.

I find this every once in a while and I have to ask what kind of impact?

Because, you know, I mean, obviously I want my boys to have like a good impact with me being an entrepreneur.

Right.

And I do kind of worry because honestly, I work really, really hard and I've like, honestly a post coming about that today just because my boys, literally, like I told you earlier, we've been sick all week.

This is my third show of the week.

It's been a week We've done some stuff.

Sorry.

Yeah.

This is my third interview of the week, my fourth show of this week.

Plus, I've been fighting a flu.

The whole family's just been fighting sickness.

And my son comes up to me last night.

I'm making a tea.

He goes, dad, why do you work so hard?

Yeah.

And I just kind of had to sit down and say, because that's what it takes, you know, that's what it takes.

Nothing will be handed to you.

And, you know, I mean, they're very privileged young men.

Yeah.

Want them to.

I don't want them to grow up thinking that life will just be handed to them and that it's just easy.

Right.

And I do kind of wonder, because I grew up, my dad had his own company, but he only ever worked for one company.

So, like, for me, it always just seemed like employment.

He was just gone a lot.

Right, right.

But I always wanted to ask, you know, whenever I have somebody like you who grew up with their parent running their own company, what was your experience with that?

Was it a positive one?

Did you.

Do you learn good work ethic?

You know, what was that like?

Yeah, there's a duality in it.

Right.

So, like, I 100 learned good work ethic.

My dad is, like, the hardest worker I've ever met.

Like, he's a machine.

I don't even.

Like, he's 72, and he still works more hours than I do.

He's just on fire.

And so, you know, part of that is inspiring, and the other thing is, is, you know, so my dad.

My dad works in the car industry.

He actually owns a racetrack, which is kind of cool, but.

But what.

What I've really realized, especially over the last few years, is, like, what's really neat about that is he always followed his passion.

So he's someone who, you know, and he told me this actually, while I was getting my cpa.

And I didn't hear it at the time, but he was like, are you sure you want to go that route?

Like, that's not your passion?

Like, that's.

Is that really what you want to do?

You know, And I took that as, dad, I want to be a professional, you know, that kind of thing.

Whereas, like, I think for him, it was just like, you know, his belief system has always been like, find your passion, work really hard at it, and you will make money.

But, like, it does take effort, a lot of work ethic, you know, and it doesn't just happen.

Like, you have to make it happen.

And so I feel like I Don't know that I would have taken this giant leap of faith had I not seen it modeled from my dad.

Yeah.

On the flip side of it, growing up like that, like, yeah, he.

I mean, you know, like, I remember sick days, I would go to my dad's office and I would be, like, just sitting in his office.

Like, there was no sick days at home.

Right.

Yeah.

Or, you know, he.

He wasn't overly present at, like, coming to soccer games and coming to, you know, those kinds of things, like.

Like a lot of parents are doing now for their kids.

And so, you know, there's a lot of maybe, like, resentment built up between both my brother and I for a number of years around, like, you know, why weren't you home more?

Why aren't you there for us more, you know, in that respect?

So that was really hard.

And also, it was really hard on my mom because she was almost like a single mom at the time.

And so, you know, maybe with the information we have, you know, now, maybe it would have been a little bit different for him.

But I think also that's kind of like, what the times were like, maybe before.

So.

Yeah, so there's, like, a bit of a duality in it.

Like, there's definitely some, like, emotional healing that has had to happen to kind of, like, you know.

But looking back on it now, I'm also so incredibly proud of my dad because, like, he has built, like, what he's done for Canadian racing.

Like, he was entered into the Canadian hall of Fame last year.

You know, he's like.

He's such a legacy in what he's built and done.

And so it just.

It makes me really proud to, like, have him as my dad and to know, like, he's went through some really.

And I mean, like, really incredibly messy times of building that business.

Yeah.

And so I think just, like, seeing how many times he's alone, had to rebuild himself.

He's never filed for bankruptcy, even though there's been, you know, financial stress and stuff like that, to just, like, see how he can navigate it.

And he's so resilient.

He's like.

I don't know.

It's.

It's.

And he's so full of life.

That's the other part.

Like, he loves what he does.

Yeah.

He's much.

Got so.

So much purpose in him, and he's so lit up all the time that it's like, when I grow up, I want to be like that, you know?

Yeah.

No, that's amazing.

That's absolutely amazing.

I know.

You Know, I, I have that same fear.

And it's funny because, you know, 99% of the work I do now is from home, but yet I'm still like working.

So there's still that like, lack of presence at times where I'm like, oh my gosh, am I, am I being a good dad here?

Like, I do have that same struggle.

And it's funny because I work from home and I can see them pretty much at any time.

But me, to work effectively, I really have to just lock myself away and get it done.

Right?

Totally.

I do worry about that.

I do worry sometimes about that, like, lack of presence.

You know, I do make the games, I do do all that stuff.

But there's still that like question all the time where it's like, is work is my work ethic or is the way I work going to have long term negative impacts in my ability to be a good dad?

And I do worry about that.

You know what?

I think the fact that you even worry about that is an amazing sign.

Right.

Because that means that you're aware of it.

And so that means.

And I think the another thing is, you know, I'm not a parent myself, but I see all my friends going through it.

I don't think it's, I don't think there's a right and a wrong with it.

You know, one thing that I've really realized about my dad is something that I like, sure, he's not perfect, and I definitely wouldn't say he is, but he's always there.

You know, when I need him there, he, he picks up.

When I need him there, he'll drop everything and come.

Like, I don't feel like I'm not important to him.

And so to me I'm like, you know what?

Yeah, but I love to see him more, of course.

But if the, if he's so happy doing what he's doing and he's like living his legacy and having an impact, and when I do call him, he's like always happy and having fun, then like, maybe that's an okay trade off.

Yeah, well, I think the other side of it too, and the part that I kind, that I find funny is that, you know, my, my boys are incredibly privileged young men.

You know, we just bought a beautiful home.

It's got a hot tub, it's got a big yard, it's a big house.

And they don't understand, right?

Like, they could care less where they grow up.

That's the thing.

And you don't really realize that you always think like, oh, well, I want to give my kids the best life possible.

I want to get.

And trust me, they're getting a much better upbringing than the one I had.

My parents did the best they could.

I'm doing the best I can, and I hope one day they can do even better than me.

But I think the funny thing is, is that for a kid, they don't care.

Right.

They don't understand how good they have it or how.

How good they don't have it.

What they understand is, was my mom there?

Was my dad there when I needed them?

Were they there?

I think that that's like the universal incredible thing about kids is that they don't see success in money, they don't see success in the house they live in or the things they have.

I think they're all measuring, am I loved?

Am I cared about?

Do my parents care?

Yeah.

And so I think even under that, I think as long as you're showing them that you love them, that you care about them, and the time that you do spend with them is quality time, I don't know, I'd say you're doing amaz.

I. I thank you for that.

I think I have a lot of room to grow still.

I. I don't know.

It's hard.

It's really hard.

And I think that's why we're here to have this conversation today.

And I really love having these conversations.

The mental health conversations, the work life balance conversations.

We're all struggling.

And I'll tell you what, I don't.

I'll speak for every leader out there.

I don't care how much money you make.

I don't care how big your company is.

We are all still struggling with our own personal challenges, personal issues, mental health challenges, roadblocks, hitting walls, burnout.

And I would say more so with the more successful.

And you know what?

They're just keeping quiet about it, but they are struggling inside.

And I know I've struggled inside.

We talked about this before the show where I said, like, it was probably like a month ago, and I told you we had a big move coming up.

We just bought a beautiful home.

And, you know, I mean, I was working myself to the bone, and I was just.

Tons of recordings, tons of, like, real work.

I had, like, I had probably too much.

I probably bit off more than I could chew at that time.

And I was trying to just do it.

And it was a Friday, like 2 o', clock, and Shelby was in the room, and I just looked at her.

I'm like, I have to get out of here.

I don't know.

I don't care where we go.

I don't care what we do.

I don't care.

We ended up going to Saskatoon, by the way, because that's where her family is.

I was like, let's just go.

I don't care.

We're going to Saskatoon.

Like, this is great.

I just need to get away.

And, you know, it's weird because you would think that I could just get off the recording, get off the production, and it'd be done, but I can't because I work from home.

And so what ends up happening is, for me, when I hit that wall, when I hit that, like, I gotta get the hell outta here.

I actually have to leave my house.

My house isn't a safe place.

My house isn't a good feeling place.

Yeah, of course.

Because again, because it's like, I think when we were going to work, it was a little bit easier, right?

Because it's like when you're going to work, you have that transition time.

So it's like, whether it's the little commute to the office or whatever, to just kind of like, disconnect and be like, right, I'm home now.

And so I think now that we're all working from home, it's like we do need to have, like.

Like, you know, not to use a buzzword, like boundaries, but, you know, we kind of do need, like, way better boundaries.

And.

And honestly, it's a lot of discipline, right?

Of just saying, like, you know, for me, for example, this is my office, and, like, the work generally will happen in the office.

And so, like, I purposely try to, like, leave my laptop in the office.

I close the door when I'm, like, leaving, you know, and sometimes I break my own rules because if I'm really inspired or excited about something, then, yeah, I might pull it out.

But I do try to be really good about it where I'm like, okay, when I'm done, I gotta be done.

Yeah, I. I struggle with boundaries.

Don't we all?

You know what's funny?

What's funny was when I used to work at an office, it was actually incredible because home wasn't work.

I never worked at home.

Right.

So it had this, like, amazing little differentiation where I could leave the office, get home, and literally not think about work.

And to me, that was the best part about being an employee.

When I look back at, like, the best thing about working for a company was, was that I was much better able to just turn the give A off.

Totally and now I give a all the time, no matter where I'm at.

Usually at the wrong time, too.

It's always at the wrong time, right?

Because you'll probably get that, like, sprinkle of inspiration or like, I've had that too, where you're, like, out doing something, you know, with your spouse or, like, for family or whatever, and you check and you get that, like, crazy email from your client.

You're like, o my gosh, I better respond to this asap.

Or whatever.

And you just.

It's tough.

You know what I've really struggled with, Jen, is presence.

And this is where, this is where, you know, I mean, Shelby's completely right.

She'll call me out a lot and, you know, I'll be sitting at the table and she'll be like, you're here, but you're not here.

And it's like, she's absolutely right.

Like, my mind is on, like, something that I need to do or like, something that I didn't quite get done.

And I think that's where I get, that's where I struggle, is if I have, like, a task that's, like, right there, right at the end.

And it, it typically happens on this day on Fridays.

Fridays are my hardest day.

On Fridays, I always have typically one to two recordings plus the show production for my Sunday.

That's just.

And I'm an idiot.

I probably should do it differently, but that's the way I've done it forever.

And it works for me, or it doesn't work for me, whatever you want to call it.

But that's the way I've done it.

And it was a Friday afternoon and I was right there.

I had, like, I think I had, like, my post done up, and I was just waiting for my videos to be finished and then I could be done.

I could have it as well scheduled, and I could be done the weekend.

And she was mad.

She wanted me to be done work.

And rightly so.

It's Friday night, right?

And, But I got up there and I, I, I reluctantly shut it down and I went up there and all I could think about the whole night was how I was just about done.

And if I could just get downstairs and do that last 10 minutes, I'd be done.

And g, it's so fraking frustrating because it's my own, it's my own problem.

Do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

Well, it's hard, too, because you feel like no matter what, you're disappointing someone, you're either disappointing yourself or you're disappointing Your loved one and both suck.

Yeah, that's right.

That's right.

And I kind of feel like too, like, sure.

Like as an entrepreneur or as somebody who runs a podcast or whatever else, there's always something to do.

Like, the reality is I could work 24 hours a day and I'll be done.

Like, it just.

That is what it is.

And I don't know what it is about, like, me, like, you know, man, I. I like to say that I'm like a high performance person.

Like, I like to succeed.

I hate failure.

And I know, like, tech startup, fail fast, fail, fun, whatever, but I still hate failing.

Don't we all?

Don't we all?

For me, I swear to God, I like, you know, I mean, I've succeeded more so just due to grit and determination in almost everything that I've done over and.

And for right or for wrong.

You know what I mean?

I've talked to a lot of people who are like, you know, Kelly, you would have succeeded anyway if you would have just given the time.

Right.

I think it was Tash Jeffries I was talking to, and she's like, you know, you'll succeed either way.

It's just how fast you succeed, it's like, well, I want to succeed as fast as.

Yeah, yeah, well, because that's the ambition, right?

Like, there's like a certain, like, good hustle that comes with it.

Actually.

I'm so curious what your human design is.

I wonder if you're a man.

You're either a Manny Gen or a Jen, I bet.

Oh, I don't know.

I don't know.

I'm just a crazy millennial, but I don't know.

You know, I guess at the end of the day.

At the end of the day, I just want to.

I just want to do something that matters.

And I think the thing that really keeps me coming back, like, the reality is this podcast.

It doesn't a fortune, right?

Like, we do.

All right?

But it's a passion project because I love business development, I love entrepreneurship, and I love doing these things right?

Like this.

This is never gonna make me a multi, multi millionaire or 100 millionaire or whatever, right?

But it's something I love doing.

And at this point, too, we have so many worldwide listeners around the world.

I know the impact that we have with this show.

And so it isn't just about.

It's so much bigger than me.

Do you know what I mean?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Because it's also like your legacy.

It's like a bit of legacy.

And.

And I want to make an impact.

And this is the way that I've been able to do it.

Right.

And so, I don't know, it's tough.

It's really hard to, like, balance that and everyday life.

And I think a lot of leaders really struggle with that.

And I've been talking a lot, so I want to just, you know, let you talk, and I want to know some of the leaders that you've been coaching.

Am I unique in this, or is this something that, like, you're running into over and over and over again?

Totally.

This is such a common thread.

So, like, one.

I don't want to make you feel bad because, like, you're not alone in it, but also, like, you're not alone in it.

Right.

Because sometimes I think as leaders, when we are struggling with these things, it's like you can feel like you're a loan shark.

Like, oh, my goodness, am I the only one who's struggling with this?

Yeah.

And the reality is, like, I think all of us are.

You know, I know before the show, we were talking a little bit about this, too, is.

It's.

I also think working is so different than it was 10 to 15 years ago.

You know, like, I remember when talking to, like, people in audit and that, like, they were still.

They weren't even using 20 years ago.

They.

They were doing everything pen to paper.

Yeah, Right.

So, like, our efficiency and our effectiveness with tech and all that stuff has just completely changed how fast we now work.

So just, like, our brains are consuming so much.

Plus, you add in social media and all these things, we're, like, getting bombarded by information.

Like, literally bombarded, whether it's notifications or articles or posts or whatever, text messages.

And then you, like, look at, like, everything else going on in the world because it's like, such a shit show.

It's just like, there's so much disruption happening right now.

And so it's just.

I think everybody feels that.

So it's, you know, just the pressure and the.

The noise out there is really crazy.

And so it's just.

I think I really do.

I think all of us are actually struggling with this.

I think anyone that's a high performer that is, like, really trying to have an impact.

And also, like, you know, most of us also want.

Not only do we want to have an impact, we want fulfillment, you know, we want to have good relationships, and we want to be healthy, and we want to, you know, have successful businesses and not have to struggle to put dinner on the table, you know, and raise our kids well.

And it's so funny because, like, fundamentally, I think we all actually want the same things.

Yeah, I agree.

I, I don't know, it's just tough because it feels too, like, with technology and everything's advancing so quickly that it just feels like there's a new task, there's something new to add to the plate all the time.

Right?

Like, you know, let's go back 20 years.

You could start a company, just do that one thing, and that would be good.

Like, you could, you could provide that one service and everyone would be happy, and you wouldn't have to do social media and you wouldn't have to really advertise a lot.

You could do things like word of mouth for the most part, like, it was just a different world.

And now you can have a really successful business or a really great product, but if you aren't great at using social media or at marketing that product, you're going to really struggle to sell it.

So, so now not only do you have to be good at business, now you have to be like a salesperson.

You have to be, you know, a social media personality.

You have to start a podcast, you have to start a YouTube channel, you have to be on LinkedIn all the time.

Like, it's just, like, it's not enough to just be good at something.

You have to be good at something.

And, and, and, and every year it's a new and.

And yet my time stays the same.

That's right.

The amount of time I can contribute is the exact same, even though the tasks are just building up and up and up and up and up.

Yeah, it's great, right?

Yeah, well, and it's true, right?

And like, not only just all the ones you said, then you talk about, like, tax regulations, you got to make HST payments and corporate stuff.

And like, even as an accountant, I'm like, this is challenging.

I'm like, I don't know how everyone else is dealing with this.

Yeah, it's.

It's been a lot, you know, you've seen, because over the past little bit, I've been trying to be more personal, more authentic.

I want to, like, step back from AI.

Right.

It's funny because, you know, when I started this show, I started out by saying, you know, in a time of AI and robots, be human.

And yet the further I went down this path, the more I started using AI to just help me streamline all of these thousand things that I have to do, because I need to do it in a more compressed time.

But what, what kind of ended up happening Was is that, you know, nothing stands out because AI is just so perfect.

There's nothing human about it.

And so it's funny because I did a post last week and I just.

Just, honestly, I just typed it all up by hand.

Mistakes and all.

Me and all.

I am not an English major.

I am not great at grammar.

Start that out.

And I just wrote it out and I said, hey, look, ma, no hands.

This post is completely written by Kelly Kennedy.

No AI whatsoever.

Here's some of the challenges I'm facing.

Put a picture up with it.

That got the most engagement gen that I've had since I launched this show.

That one.

Wow.

And it's crazy because to me, I think what it shows is, like.

Like, how much we're just craving real people.

100%.

100% we're craving real people.

And like, you know, the other thing that I would add to it is, like, just from like, an operations perspective and like, this is something that I. I think is super important for business owners in general is it's like, you know, we try to do all the things, but often we don't have to do all the things because again, it's like that one, like, one post did better than all the other engagement.

Right?

So that one post probably drove more people potentially to your podcast and to the other work that you're doing than some of the other stuff.

So it's like, you know, something that that's really on my mind lately is like, you know, here's a 10 task, but which one is actually going to move the needle?

And as I'm doing this, it's like five fingers.

It should be like this, but like, here's our 10 tasks.

So, like, again, which one is the one that's actually going to move the needle?

Or is this all just busy work?

Yeah.

And you know what?

I think I've done a lot of busy work, especially in growing a podcast.

And in all fairness, it's because God knows what works with growing a podcast.

If I had all the answers at this point, I would still have, like, the number one show in North America.

And I don't.

It's flipping hard.

It's flipping hard.

It's hard to understand.

It's hard to understand what works, what doesn't work, why my numbers are up today, why they're down today.

There is not a lot of good data in what works.

And so, yeah, there's been a lot of tasks, like, you know, for a long time.

I did, like, probably 30 group posts every single time that I posted A show or something on LinkedIn.

I have no idea if it worked or not, but I did it and it like, for all I know, it could have done nothing.

Like you said, it could have had like no engagement at all.

But you don't know what's working and what's not.

And so you do everything.

Totally.

And sometimes there's an experimentation phase too, right.

Where you kind of have to.

Because you don't know what you don't know.

So you're like, okay, I'm gonna just throw a bunch of spaghetti at the wall and just see what's gonna actually stick.

Yeah, it's really hard too.

And you know, I.

Let's just talk about marketing for a second.

Because all businesses, small, medium, large have limited marketing budgets.

You know, they're trying most they can with limited budgets.

Marketing, unfortunately, has just been this area that's really hard to know whether or not you're, you're, you're actually getting results for your dollars spent or not.

And it's designed that way.

It's designed very well to keep you really like, oh, maybe it worked, maybe it didn't.

Keep throwing money at it and see what happens.

Right.

But it's really tough when you're working with limited budgets and trying to make an impact and figure out what works and what doesn't.

You're right, you have to experiment.

But I think we do end up in this place where we're like, I don't know what works.

I'm just going to keep doing everything I'm doing because I'm getting the results.

But yeah, I agree, it's, I just think it's really hard to figure out what those things are that we should be eliminating.

Yeah.

So you know what, so one of the things.

So like in, when I was working in tech, we use Scrum.

So I'm like a huge fan actually of using Agile and Scrum and I've been like exploring how do you use that in like a small business kind of thing.

Because Scrum teams tend to be like at least three people teams which like, when you're a solopreneur, it's like you.

Yeah, you and you.

Or maybe there's like, maybe you have like someone that works part time.

Right.

So you're like, okay.

And so one of the things that I started doing that I find really helpful to figure out what works is to like, so every week.

And so I've got a virtual assistant that I work with.

And so we just do this together and we do everything together in terms of Trying to figure this out, which is, like, three simple questions.

What's going really well?

What didn't go so well, and what's, like, one thing that I want to do differently next week?

And so just, like, getting that laser focus, because it's those small little steps that will add up into bigger changes versus, like, well, I found it.

I don't know if this is.

This applies to you, but, like, I tend to.

I'm like.

I'm like, let me just burn it down and do it again, you know, like, instead of these micro changes, it's like, I want to do it all at once.

It's all or nothing, you know?

And what I've learned is that really doesn't work, but what does tend to work is if I just tweak it every little bit.

Like, every week, I tweak it slightly and a little bit more and a little bit more, and I get more and more clear.

And then it doesn't also feel like I've just created all this extra work for myself.

Off.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think for me, what I've kind of tried to do is just like.

Like you said, do, like, two weeks trying something.

Two weeks trying something.

Two weeks trying something and see what works.

I think the challenge, especially with growing a media channel, a podcast, a YouTube channel, something like that, is that there's also peak times that your listeners will engage.

And so it's not just enough to, like, market.

You need to market at the right times to actually get them right.

Like, so I think for a show more like, what we're doing, probably, like, you know, an early new year is when people are really thinking about, how can I do better in business growth for 2025.

That's fair.

Yeah.

There's seasons for everything.

So, like, for instance, advertising the show in the summer probably isn't as effective as advertising the show in January, but once again, trial and error.

And that can change, too, which also gets very confusing and fun.

Oh, it's hard.

And it's so hard to navigate when you're a solopreneur.

Right.

Because you're just like.

Because.

Yeah, me too.

Like, I had no idea that literally nobody would want coaching over the summer, which, like, you know, when I think common sense, I'm like, probably makes sense.

I probably wouldn't want coaching in the summer either, because, like, you know, summer's the only beautiful time in Canada, so it's like, everybody wants to be on vacation.

Yeah.

And then also, same thing happens around Christmas, and so it becomes so hard because, like, when You're.

Because you're trying to like, grow your business and then also being like, oh, right.

So I have to expect that I might not get any contracts during these periods.

So, like, I'm going to have to build that into, you know, how, how do I mitigate this?

How do I figure that out?

How do I build more consistency?

Yeah, yeah, I agree completely.

And I think too, like, you know, one of the ways that you can obviously do that is you can offer other services that are maybe like a little more longer term than a coaching.

Totally.

I know for us, for instance, we do training, we do coaching, and we do business development retainers as needed from time to time.

I'm doing a lot less retainers these days, a lot more on the coaching and training.

But, you know, I still take on the, the occasional retainer.

Why?

Because I actually love business development.

I still do.

Like, I, I don't want to be completely removed from the thing that I love.

I.

But I still don't.

I only take on like a handful of them.

Yeah, well, hey, that's.

And it's good too, because again, you're like continuing to refine and build those skills.

Exactly.

I think on a certain level you have to stay in at least a little bit in order to like, keep up to date.

Otherwise you just get left behind.

Yeah, totally.

And then you become really out of touch.

Right.

Which we also see with a lot of leaders.

Like, because if you're, if you're so out of touch, then it's like, then you're really not having that impact that you initially set out.

Yeah, no, and, you know, I want to talk a little bit about work life balance.

And this comes up on the show all the time.

I'm not sure that I'm a believer.

I've never found it.

Although I'll tell you what, I've talked with enough high level expert people who have made millions of dollars who say eventually they found it.

But it was definitely hard work, grind and grit to get them there.

Not to mention God knows how many lost relationships between their spouses, divorces, kids, what?

Oh, yeah, it's been crazy.

You know, I mean, there's always been a price.

Yeah.

What I've seen.

But ultimately, you know, I, I've had people come on and say, yeah, I found work life balance.

Like, I work four hours a day now, Kelly.

However, it took me 10 years and two divorces and I have no relationship with my kid to get there.

Which is like, kind of scary because when I kind of look at that, it's like, yeah, I want work, life balance, and I want to be successful.

How can I have both?

Is it even possible to do that without blowing up my life?

Yeah.

Is that a question?

No, it's just a, Just like a qu.

It's an internal question, right?

Yeah.

I don't know.

I don't know the answer to that.

I, I, I think the question is, yes, I definitely think you can do both.

I think it just, It's.

There's a lot of intentionality that has to go behind it.

Right.

So as an example, so, like, you know, Dave and I have been together 11 years.

We've been through a ton of up and ups and downs together, you know, but one of the things that we set on early and because I knew that my ambition was, Was pretty intense, was I said, dave, you're, You're.

I'm gonna put you first, though.

Yeah.

So my ambition, you come first.

So if you tell me that I need to be somewhere and I'm telling you that I need to work, then I will.

I'm gonna trust that you don't pull that card all the time, but that when you need me there, that I. I'll be there.

And so just, I think, I think it will look really different for every person, but I think it's just about start, like, having those honest conversations with the people in your life that you really care about, because you don't really know how they're feeling.

They might.

Might be totally fine with it, and they might not.

And I think we're like, you know, I see a lot of turmoil happen with families, especially with ambition, is because the ambition always takes the number one role.

And so sometimes it does have to drop to number two or number three or number four.

Just like, maybe not all the time.

Walk me through that, because I can already see the pushback from your clients.

Right.

And I know, however, like, I've worked really hard to get here.

I've put in a lot of time.

I don't, I don't want to risk.

Risk that.

And I can already do that being the, you know, the statement, because I think to us, it feels like, well, if I take a step back, I risk losing everything I've worked for.

Now.

Is that now?

And I guess the question is that could be total and it pro, and it might be like, it might be total.

Like there might be.

It might be that, like, you know, when you've worked hard to get to a certain stage, you've worked hard to get there.

No one can take that from you.

You'll at least hold that.

But I don't know.

I think it's always felt to me like.

Like if I was to step back, I would be lesser somehow.

Yeah.

And you know what?

Like, this is where I. I really believe in, like, the subconscious reprogramming work and the limiting beliefs, because often that's really what it is.

Right.

There's like, some kind of a subconscious belief, even though logically we know these things don't necessarily make sense.

Yeah.

But it's like, subconsciously, somewhere there might be something that says, if I'm not.

If I'm not constantly putting my business in the number one spot, then I will lose it.

Yeah.

You know, and that might be what the belief is.

And so what's happening is like, we're now like, so what happens at a subconscious level is if that's the belief that we have, then those are the actions that we take, too.

Which means, like, you're constantly firefighting for your business because you're like, if I even step away for three seconds, I could lose it.

Yeah.

You know, but, like, I'm sure there's a bigger range between three seconds and losing your business.

Yeah, I know, I know, I know.

It.

It sounds crazy.

But, you know, I mean, I, I.

Almost everybody that I've talked to on this show who's really, like, I can tell that, like, we're all on that same, like, go, go, go, go, wavelength.

Yeah.

Just.

And, you know, I'm proud of that.

I think.

I think there's a part of me that's always been proud that I've had a strong work ethic kid.

My dad and my brothers always instilled, you know, work hard, be honest, do, you know, do the right things, show up.

And I wouldn't be where I'm at today if I didn't do those things.

However.

Yeah.

It's like, how are those negatively impacting my life today?

And I, like, it could be pretty substantial.

And you know what.

And here's.

Here's the other thing.

So, like, you know, so coactive.

Coactive is.

Is one of the.

Is who I'm certified through.

And I freaking love their models.

So their whole thing is like, you know, values.

So, for example, one of your values is probably strong work ethic.

Right.

So, like, you know, and.

And then I think there's a strong value probably of integrity and maybe a strong value of excellence.

Violence.

You tell me if those are correct.

Yeah, sounds right.

Yeah.

And so probably what's happening.

This is sound a little offside.

They might be like little terrorists, in a way, you know, that's about.

Those are values that have just gone, like, way, way, way out of whack.

Yeah.

And so then the other question is, it's like, what values are they stepping on?

Because there's obviously something else.

And so the question is, is how do we kind of pull them back down to reality and maybe shine some of these other values a little?

Oh, man.

I, like, I'm probably, like, textbook workaholic, but, yeah, I've definitely found that, like, one of the challenges that I had is, I think as I started growing my business, as everything kind of started getting bigger and bigger and bigger and.

And I really started to love it.

Like, I really love what I do.

I think being the other side of it, it's like, I couldn't do this if I didn't love what I do.

But I think, like, my love of what I do has almost superseded my love of, like, the things I used to love.

Yeah.

Which can definitely cause some, like, shakeups.

Like, because here's the thing.

Thing.

If the thing that I used to love doing, like, let's say, like, when I was a kid, I used to love, you know, building model airplanes and flying model.

I know it's nerdy, but that's my thing.

I love it.

That's so cool.

But if I.

But if I'm, you know, I mean, if I think now, what I find is that if I was to sit down in my garage and start building a new model, I'm sure, like, there would just be this nagging thing at the back of my head that's like, this is a waste of time.

Why don't you go and build your business, which is actually meaningful work.

Right.

I think that genuinely is one of the challenges that I struggle with now.

Like, for instance, like, I used to love playing video games.

And I was kid.

A kid.

I don't even play video games down.

And it's weird because I always thought, like, oh, I'll play a lot of games with my kids.

Like, that sounds awesome.

Like, I'll be that dad.

And I am not the dad I thought I would be.

I don't think anybody is.

I don't think anybody is the parent.

They think they're gonna be a very different parent.

I'm actually.

I think there's still times that I really surprise myself.

Yeah, I'm sure.

And, like, you know, I think really coming back to, like, even the model airplanes and, like, the things that you used to do, I think this is like.

Like, I think this Is like a really sad reality of being an adult is I think we just, everything has to be like, like productive, right?

Like it's like, okay, like you don't just have fun anymore for the sake of just having fun, you know?

So like something even that I've been exploring over the last couple years is like, think like more creative stuff.

Because I, what I do notice is when I actually take time to like go for a walk and go in nature or paint or like sing or like, I don't know, do these like more like woo.

Kind of like creative, kind of like artsy kind of things.

I actually sometimes like, I'll be thinking, let's say I have a presentation that I need to do and I'm like, I don't know what to write in it.

I don't know.

And I go for a walk and the whole like I just get the whole presentation like that I'm like, I know exactly what I'm going to do.

And so what I've noticed is sometimes it ends up being so much more efficient and so much more effective actually because I gave myself that space to do those things.

But I think again we get so caught in the grind of just like checkboxing and doing things and then, and then we're like, who the hell has time to sing?

Like, why would I do that?

Yeah, yeah, sounds exactly right.

Right.

And, and it sucks because like on a certain level, and I want to talk about freedom because when I was a kid, my biggest value was freedom.

I think as an adult I still, one of my biggest values was freedom.

My whole idea when I like went to work for myself was, oh, I'm gonna have so much more time to do the things I love, love.

And ironically, that is not what happened at all.

I work harder now for myself than I ever did for anyone else.

I guess I also have more reward than I ever did for anyone else.

So win, win.

But in, in all fairness though, I think I lost the freedom that I thought I was going to have.

Or like somehow along the lines I think I kicked freedom down the, down the road.

I think I thought, thought, okay, right now I just have to work hard.

If I work hard now, I'm going to build the company, I'm going to build myself, I'm going to build, you know, this, this brand and then I'll have freedom.

But I think the further that I go down this road, the more I realize it's just going to keep growing and growing and growing and the demands from me are going to keep growing.

And growing bigger and bigger.

Yeah.

I'm going to let myself have that freedom.

So I think you have to choose it.

I don't agree.

I don't think you get to just, just earn it.

I think if you want freedom, you have to declare, I'm going to have freedom now.

Hell yeah.

And honestly, I would even say, like, I think that's the case for all things, right?

Like, it's like, if you want, if you want a successful marriage, declare that.

Like, then I want that.

Like, how are we going to build this?

You know, obviously you don't know.

Between two people, things change.

People change.

But like, you know, commit that, like, that's something that's really important to you.

And so that, that's something that you, you're going to commit and figure out.

Like, what does that even mean?

Right.

And like, same with freedom.

Like, like even right now, like, what does that even look like to you?

Yeah.

When you think of freedom, like, how could you bake that more into where you are right now?

Well, and I think like you said, it's like a mindset shift has to happen where I can value doing something that maybe is feeling like meaningless work.

Or like meaning 100.

I need to, like, I need to get to a point where I can be okay again with doing work that's just, just for fun.

That's just, you know, what.

The other thing, you know, we haven't really touched on yet.

But you know, one of the things too that I'd be thinking about is like the nervous system, right?

So like, what ends up happening when we're like so focused on the, the tasks and the doing and everything, right.

Is like.

And also all the notifications coming in all the time.

Our nervous systems are so out of whack.

Right.

So like, chances are if I had to take a bed, you probably are stuck in like the sympathetic nervous system where it's like fight or flight.

So it's like your body thinks it's, it's like being attacked by tigers all the time.

Yeah, I think, I think I probably have like a low level anxiety all the time now.

Well, yeah.

Right.

And I, you know, I actually kind of think it's a bit of an epidemic going on where like, I think everybody's nervous system is a little out of whack.

And so that's the thing is like, as soon as you take that space to like move into the parasympathetic, so like the rest and digest, it's like you're like, this feels really unsafe.

Like, I can't just sit here.

Like, I need to go do something.

Like, this is really, really uncomfortable.

Yeah.

I think it's been my struggle with meditating, honestly.

As I said, I'm like, okay, this is done.

I'm gonna go do something now.

Yeah.

Oh, my gosh.

So, like, a few years ago, I did training on restorative yoga, and I did it because I knew how hard it was for me.

Like.

Like, what do you mean?

I have to lay there for 20 minutes.

Like, are you kidding me?

Like, I remember lay there for, like, a minute, and I'd be looking.

I'm like, it's only been a minute.

Like, this is insane.

No, I.

It's so weird because I wish that I could say, jen, this is when it happened.

This is.

Everything shifted.

But it's been like this, like, slow shift for so long, and it.

And it's tough because on the one hand, I recognize that, like, I need to do more for me.

I need to look after Kelly a little better.

But on the other hand, I also feel like we have momentum with the business.

We have momentum with the show, and I don't want to risk any of that, too.

And I'm having to like, constantly grow.

Right?

Like, I think, you know, we talked about this earlier.

I think just, like, the shift feels so fast.

The demands on an entrepreneur are.

It's not enough to just, like, do what you do even for a year.

You need to be growing all the time, because technology is changing.

Business is changing.

Like hell.

Even my business isn't the same business it was, like, two years ago.

Right?

Like, it's.

It's shifting so fast, and it kind of feels like if you're not.

If you're not present, if you're not there, you're gonna miss the thing you need to learn to take you to the next step.

Like, it's.

It's.

The demands are huge.

I guess is kind of what I'm getting at here is that, like.

And, like, you know, we talk about anxiety.

Like, we were talking about this before the show.

The next thing that I got to work on is video.

I'm working on it.

Video scares me.

Video is one of those things that, like, I've put off and avoided like crazy.

I've had so many video experts on this show.

Kelly, why don't you do more video?

You're incredible on video.

But it scares me.

Like, sure.

Incredible or not, whatever.

It's still something, like, for me, is super uncomfortable.

And now.

Now I have to.

Now I have to add another thing to my Low level anxiety.

You're.

Yeah, exactly.

Like, oh my gosh, here's another thing I gotta learn.

And now I'm like, yeah, exactly.

And so, like, there's a, there's a big mental load with, with constantly learning too.

Right.

And I get that it's important because at the end of the day, it's like things are shifting, and if you're not shifting with them, you're behind.

And if you're behind, you're in trouble.

That's entrepreneurship.

Right.

You really gotta try and keep up to date.

Right.

But it's, it's a lot.

It's a lot.

I think it's never been easier to be an entrepreneur and never been harder.

Yeah, it's both.

It's totally both.

And you know, I, I think part of, you know, this is something that I've really recognized in myself for the, over the years is like, I think when we as high performers, like, and also it's just so apparent in our society is like, we really do have the all or nothing thinking.

And we also are so, you know, scared of failing.

So then we just don't even try.

Right.

Like, I can't tell you, like, especially when it came to, like, health and wellness, I remember I'd be like, okay, it's January and I'm gonna work out five days a week for an hour every day.

And then I would do that for week.

And then I would miss the first workout.

Yeah.

And then I would miss the second one.

And then it's March and I've never been back to the gym.

You know, we, we bought an elliptical last year and it collects dust.

Right, exactly.

Yeah, exactly.

And so, you know, something that I think is actually incredibly powerful, though, is to just like, switch that dynamic.

And like, what does feel doable?

Maybe it's a minute.

What if you spent a minute, a day in silence and just see what happens?

And like, maybe, maybe the next month you try too many minutes.

You know, like, these don't have to be crazy things, but it's like you also want to give yourself a win because, you know, again, as achievers, we like to check that box.

And when we're not checking the box and we're failing ourselves, then we just drop it off because we're like, oh, I can be successful in these other things, so I'm just going to focus on that instead.

Yeah.

Oh, man, it's hard.

It's tough.

It's tough.

And I know that there's a lot of people that are really into this conversation because it's a great conversation and I know it resonates with so many entrepreneurs, listeners listening, and I know they're all saying, well okay, but what's the answer?

Like how, what, how do we find a way out?

And so Jen, I need you to bring me into it.

Like, talk to me about your coaching program.

What is it designed to do?

Who is it for?

Where do you do it?

Yes, I mean a big piece of it is just like, I would say just in general is, it's, it's, you gotta just keep it's experimenting, figure out what is gonna work for you.

Because what is gonna work for you might be different than others.

And so the way that I work with people, so if I'm doing individual coaching, I was saying to you earlier, this is where we get to be like a little more fluid, a little more expansive maybe and a little more fun.

And so, you know, I do a lot of energy work.

So like a lot of my clients, we do reiki, which is like, it's like so on the scale of woo, which you know, as a finance person, I can't tell you that I ever thought this was going to be part of my line of work.

But anyway, you know, because it's, it's, it's an ancient Japanese technique where basically I'm channeling energy, which sounds insane, but I tell you it works wonders.

My clients love it.

And I'm like, like okay, cool.

And what that does is just helps clear your energy because part of it, you know, that I'm realizing is like a lot of us are so un, like we're not self aware enough to know.

We have high degrees of empathy, we have high degrees of personable skills, but we have like no self awareness.

We don't really know like how much energy on you is actually yours, how much is someone else's, which again is kind of a weird conversation to have.

But, but by starting to get more in tune with like how does your energy function?

Like, like what lights you up, what doesn't light you up, what is burning you out?

You know, by starting to understand your energy better, you can start managing those things better.

Because it starts with that awareness.

Some of it is like subconscious reprogramming, which also is totally a bit woo.

But I tell you, it's like, it's so you see how fast it works and how, how good it is because again, you're like getting into those really dupe deep.

Oh my gosh, I can't even speak.

I'm so excited.

Getting into these like really, really deep Rooted subconscious beliefs that, like, logically, we know make no sense.

Like, you know, I. I know logically it makes no sense that I put such a high degree of value on my productivity, but subconsciously, it 100 runs the show.

And so, you know, by starting to be able to work through some of those subconscious beliefs, like, the results are mind blowing.

And then the other part of it is just, you know, it's building that accountability.

So, you know what most of my clients tell me is it.

It's holding that space, because when you have a coaching engagement, when you have a coach, you have that time in your calendar every other week or once a month or whatever it is that you do.

Yeah.

And.

And just that alone allows you to really start focusing on your goals, whether they're your professional goals, whether they're your personal goals, and just, like, making sure that you are taking care of yourself.

So I feel like I just went on such a huge tangent that hopefully everybody got what I do, but that's kind of the just of it.

No, I agree.

I agree.

You know, it's nice to have somebody in your corner, really.

And that's what a coach is.

There's somebody who, like.

Or success is their problem, too.

And that's nice, because as an entrepreneur, most of the time our success is only our problem, and we're the only ones trying to figure it out.

So it's really.

It's nice to have somebody, especially somebody like you, who's had, like, incredible corporate experience, you've led a massive company, so to be able to, like, bring that down to earth and say, hey, you can do this, and you can be mentally okay, too.

How about that?

Right?

Like, I think this is it.

It does take somebody like you, who's been on both sides, who has kind of had to deal with that big mental load, and say, okay, look, you can do both.

And.

And I think especially for, like, an entrepreneur like myself who didn't really have a lot of models to go from, it was just, go, go, go, go, go, go, go.

So it was really nice for me to start to meet other people in high leadership roles to be able to say, hey, Kelly, like, what about this?

Or, like, have you thought about this?

Are you okay?

Like, first off, are you okay?

And I was like, no, I'm not okay.

Yeah, like, but, like, you're always trying to be okay, right?

Like, you want the world to think you're okay.

But I think most people in leadership positions are like, no, like, I am struggling 100.

Right.

And I think also, like, that that ebbs and flows, right?

Because, like, sometimes you feel so on top of your game, and then other times you just feel like you've just, like, you know, you start having questions like, am I going to be successful again?

Like, can I actually do this?

Can I get myself out of this hole that somehow I found myself in?

You know?

And so I think it's just.

I think it's recognizing that it's all okay.

And I really think this, like, conversation around figuring out this balance between ambition and sustainability is so important because, like, the cost of it otherwise is, like, why we're working so hard for everything.

And the cost is your health.

The cost is burnout.

The cost is the relationships around you.

You know, again, all the things of why we did this in the first place.

Yeah.

And, like, you know, I don't care how incredible of a leader you are, if your family life is falling apart, you are not going to be okay.

Like, it.

I. I think it's, like, it's silly to think that they're different, that your home and your work life are completely independent.

They are not.

Whatever's happening at one is affecting the other.

And this is, you know, this is something that, like, I think the coaching space has been evolving as well of, like, you know, really trying to educate that, like, it is all one in the same.

Like, you know, if you're having this issue at work, chances are it's bleeding into your life and vice versa.

If you're having it at home, it's probably showing up somewhere in your work, too.

Yeah, it's.

It's all intertwined, and.

Absolutely.

We definitely need more people like yourself.

So take us into the practice space.

Talk to me about the name.

The Practice Space case.

Yeah.

So you know what?

It started off, I was running this, like, energetic mastermind a few years ago, and I just loved.

I love the name of the mastermind, and I love it because, you know, this is something that I've really realized over the last few years is, like, you're just like, you.

You don't.

Sure, we all have, like, our natural gifts, and some things come easier than others, but I truly believe everything is a practice.

Every.

Every habit that you're building, every skill that you're building, it's a practice.

And like.

Like, I think it's.

Oh, I forget who said this, but the book outliers, you know, they talk about the 10,000 hours to become an expert, and, like, that's how you get good at something.

And so the practice space is really about, like, creating a space for people so they can practice, so that they can fail, that they can talk about the hard that they can, you know, work through those things.

They can come back and fail again.

Like all of it's okay because it's all part of the growth journey.

Yeah.

And you mentioned that you do both one on one and group coaching.

Is this, is this across Canada or strictly in Ontario for now?

It's, it's so actually a lot.

I have clients in Australia, I have clients in the U.S. so like, you know, wherever, wherever, wherever people are.

As long as we can make the time zone work in terms of, you know, one on one and stuff like that, I'll coach anybody anywhere, as long as it's the right fit too, of course, for both of us.

But yeah, most of the stuff that I do is one on one.

I am looking into doing some group stuff.

I'm actually thinking about kicking off this like this future of work piece has been really on my mind.

So I'm actually playing with, with those which we'll see, we'll see where that goes.

So there might be some group stuff around that coming up.

Yeah, I run some leadership programs for some, some of my corporate clients and so, so yeah, I just, my biggest thing is just really being, being able to show up with like the crazy skills and you know, learning that I like to do is just how can I be a partner, how can I be a support?

How can I help people?

Amazing.

Well, like Jen, let me just say you have incredible energy.

I imagine that all of your clients are incredibly fortunate people and, and look forward to every session.

You know, how do people get a hold of you if they want to potentially book you for a session?

Session?

Yeah.

I mean the easiest way honestly is email.

I'm pretty, pretty there all the time.

Or like LinkedIn message.

Like I'm so personable, just message me.

We can have a conversation.

That tends to be the best way.

I also have like, for people, if, let's say you're like on the fence, like, you're kind of like, I just want to know what you're up to.

Like, I don't really know if I'm up to have a conversation quite yet.

I have a mailing list, so I started.

It's called the Leadership Lab.

I put it out.

It's a newsletter that I put out monthly.

And I just try to conglomerate a bunch of different resources for people, different kinds of things.

And so that's a great place to go to.

Amazing, amazing.

And what is your email for them to reach out to you.

Yeah, it's Jen J E N n. So there's two ends on that at thepracticespace.

Co co.com had that mixed up before.

Okay, I'll make sure that I have your website as well linked in the show notes for the show, so.

So you can find it there.

Jen, this has been absolutely incredible.

Thank you for coming on with me today.

Thank you so much for having me.

This is so much fun.

Kelly, I love your energy too.

You are definitely having the impact in the world that you are wanting to.

So I think we're so lucky that you have a podcast like this and that you're so willing to show up and so just thank you for all the hard work that you put in to, to show up for us.

Oh, thank you.

No, it's been, it's been a blessing for sure.

Right.

Like, couldn't do a show like this without incredible people like you out there to do it with me.

So thank you.

Thank you.

Ah, thanks.

Until next time, this has been episode 286 of the Business Development podcast and we will catch you on the flip side.

This has been the Business Development Podcast with Kelly Kennedy.

Kelly has 15 years in sales and business development experience within the Alberta oil and gas industry and founded his own business development firm in 2020.

His passion and his specialization is in customer relationship generation and business development.

The show is brought to you by Capital Business Development, your business development specialists.

For more, we invite you to the website at www.capitalbd.ca.

see you next time on the Business Business Development Podcast.